Driver engagement? Selling/buying...

[BimmerFan]

Update: I borrowed the A6 last night. Disappointing. I'm not surprised though, honestly.

I was going to borrow it for the entire day, today, to really get a feel for it, but after about 3 miles I already knew that it wasn't going to work out between us, so I took it back.

I think that the Caddy, despite its flaws, sets the bar way too high for most other cars to even get close.

Maybe I'll take the unrealized savings from two cars' depreciation and buy a new watch.

 

[NorCal Blackwing]

Good! That's actually the answer I was hoping for. You don't see many Carrera Ts around. I had my hopes up for a 992.1 GT3 allocation at the dealer where I bought my GT4, but I was not high enough on the list for that generation, so my "spot" (hopefully) rolled over to the 992.2 gen. Which is now crazy expensive. And IMHO less attractive than the prior gen.

TL DR I have been considering the T as a "poor man's GT3" but even the T is now quite expensive...

Curious to hear thoughts on the Carrera T. Whether it is worth the price of entry, or a prior-gen GT3 is a better bet.

Yes, the TTs are insane cars, but I think again the usable performance debate reappears in that context.

I was not expecting to find this question in this chat but it's one I'm well qualified to answer! I've owned a 991.2 (2019) Carrera T since new in 2019, and along with the Blackwing it's in the 'will never sell' category. For context, I traded in a GT4 for it and I could not be happier with my choice.

The Carrera T is pretty boring on the commute, and you don't get many thrills from the straight line acceleration. It is, however, a straight up delight on twisty canyon backroads. It's not as sonorous as a GT3 but you don't need to wind it out to 7-8K RPM and hit felony speeds to really enjoy it. It has just the right amount of power and the suspension is more compliant for bumpy broken up backroads. It's hard to describe but it's just a perfectly balanced set of attributes for that use case. (Edit: I see from your profile you have a 330i ZHP so, you get it...)

If you can find a sorted 991.2 I would have it over the 992 T. Narrow body, more special interior packs, analogue gauges, arguably better looking, cheaper. Mine is tight as a drum with not a single rattle, after over 5 years of running it ragged over hellish Bay Area backroads. The stock shifter is great, not BW level great, but can be upgraded with a Numeric shifter for a shorter notchier throw.

 

[white98ls]

Highway in anything is pretty boring. 5BW gets halfway decent highway mileage, maybe 24mpg? To me it seems a little silly to buy a brand new, yet boring car, to get what, 30% better mpg?

I'd either get something outrageously cushy and quiet used (an 8-9 year old 7-series is like $20k) or - I know you said no EV - but a Model S/X rides nicely, has good driving asst tech and won't cost you much to run. Then spend the rest on a GR86, Porsche or something else fun. But to me, taking the hit of a ~$75k (assuming A6) new car just to eat up highway miles while still having decent but not great mileage/operating cost makes little sense. Might as well get a slightly used, loaded Accord and spend a fraction for mostly the same experience.

 

[Atemoya]

it's not perfect, but nothing is. Except my wife

Is this a pre-emptive move to get a Rolls Royce?

 

[BimmerFan]

Highway in anything is pretty boring. 5BW gets halfway decent highway mileage, maybe 24mpg? To me it seems a little silly to buy a brand new, yet boring car, to get what, 30% better mpg?

I'd either get something outrageously cushy and quiet used (an 8-9 year old 7-series is like $20k) or - I know you said no EV - but a Model S/X rides nicely, has good driving asst tech and won't cost you much to run. Then spend the rest on a GR86, Porsche or something else fun. But to me, taking the hit of a ~$75k (assuming A6) new car just to eat up highway miles while still having decent but not great mileage/operating cost makes little sense. Might as well get a slightly used, loaded Accord and spend a fraction for mostly the same experience.

You made some excellent points, thank you.

I did have yesterday off, so I test drove a new E-class with the four cylinder mild hybrid. I really dislike 4's, but they have adequate power these days, and the Mercedes is so quiet that you hardly hear the thrashing. The tech in the car was just confusing, and of course, infamous M-B reliability.

I'm not buying an 8 year-old BMW for numerous reasons, but I did find a nice 2022 still under factory warranty that didn't smell. So many used cars smell, be it B.O., smokers, eaters or pet owners. It's a pet peeve of mine. #14, I believe. LOL Anywho... the 2022 has the older style iDrive (the new one SUCKS) and no hybridity and is, as you'd imagine, very quiet and comfortable. And as my wife reminds me, I can go buy an Audi or M-B or whatever, and I always come back to BMW.

As I think I noted earlier in the thread, I've decided to keep the BW. It's too special, and although the BMW will have to sit outside because of limited garage space, I think that's a sacrifice worth making.

 

[dizz81]

Which model BMW?

 

[BimmerFan]

Which model BMW?

740i. 2022 means G11 (LWB) and this one has 40K miles, a year/10K of warranty left, really nice condition, pretty well loaded except for B&O, and I had that on a previous BMW and I'm probably better off without it.

 

[dizz81]

Damn you went big boy captain of a boat cruiser style.

I bet she's super comfy. My M550 was super comfy and that was an "almost" M car.

 

[KnightI2]

Maybe I'll take the unrealized savings from two cars' depreciation and buy a new watch.

Now that sounds like a game plan! Probably can get a steak and tater for the grill as well and call it a GREAT day.

 

[BimmerFan]

For those following along at home, I decided to pull the trigger on the BMW (several things fell into place, it was like an omen. Times two.) on Thursday. It is as expected (I've had these before) and I'm happy with it. It ain't no BW, but then, the BW ain't no land yacht either. I think they'll make a good pair.

 

[dizz81]

For those following along at home, I decided to pull the trigger on the BMW (several things fell into place, it was like an omen. Times two.) on Thursday. It is as expected (I've had these before) and I'm happy with it. It ain't no BW, but then, the BW ain't no land yacht either. I think they'll make a good pair.View attachment 31049

Looks like the M550 I had.

I think that's why I never fell in love with it. It looks SO similar to every other BMW model that it didn't stand out at all.

 

[SS_Shooter]

Dude, the MORE miles you drive each day, the BETTER the car you should have!

If you drove 250 miles a day, you'd want to be in the BEST car possible for those 250 miles. A BW is perfect. Rolls-Royce Phantom might be better, but there are budget constraints to consider.

 

[BimmerFan]

Dude, the MORE miles you drive each day, the BETTER the car you should have!

If you drove 250 miles a day, you'd want to be in the BEST car possible for those 250 miles. A BW is perfect. Rolls-Royce Phantom might be better, but there are budget constraints to consider.

Indeed. This is why I don't get the whole concept of the beater vehicle to use daily and "save" the nice car. However, in the case of the BW versus 7 series, although the BW is better in nearly every category, it's tough to do better in luxurious quiet and ride quality than a LWB BMW 7.

 

[+ManifoldPSI]

Indeed. This is why I don't get the whole concept of the beater vehicle to use daily and "save" the nice car. However, in the case of the BW versus 7 series, although the BW is better in nearly every category, it's tough to do better in luxurious quiet and ride quality than a LWB BMW 7.

Nice. Though some may consider it boring, I approve of the gray. I always think Lamborghini Battleship Gray when I see that shade. Understated but good looking still.

Curious, have you driven a LWB back to back to a standard wheelbase option, BMW/7 or otherwise? I have never driven any LWB vs standard close together enough to know if there's a perceptible difference.

 

[+ManifoldPSI]

I posted a little bit about it in another thread but he's some takeaways.

The power is definitely more usable on normal roads and you are able to use all of it before you're going to jail.
Typical Porsche fashion the car handles like it's on rails. I'm still trying to find the limit, but it's well beyond what I feel comfortable attempting on mountain roads.
The 7MT is good (when it's good), notchy but it's not on the same level as the 6MT. I have to mentally think and adjust how much pressure to use in order to get to 4th, 5th and 6th gears. Plenty of times I've needed to downshift to 6th and it'll snap to 4th or I'll hit the gate between 4th and 6th because I didn't put pressure towards 6th. I now find myself skipping 7th gear most times because of this (unless I'm above 75mph). It's almost impossible to go from 7th to 5th because of the spring pressure. Every time I try I end up hitting 3rd. So it's come down to if I need to drop gears for whatever reason, I just rapid fire 7 > 6 > 5 > 4. It's gotten quite tedious.
The ride is on the firm side of things. It's not terrible but it's not great depending on the road surface. Also, it's loud as hell inside, not from engine noise but road noise.
There are a surprising amount of rattles in the car. You would think for what you pay, it would be solid but yeah no. My 2012 Camaro SS had less rattles at 19k miles before I traded it in because I couldn't deal with them. I've narrowed it down to somewhere in the door panels and I think the extended range fuel tank when it's full. Which I understand has a recall for.
The brakes are solid, they have tons of power to stop the car but you will start to notice you need a little extra pedal pressure once you give them a good workout on the mountain roads.

The 911T is definitely a capable car. BUT I think it's a capable car for those that can afford to just "deal" with it's faults. I am not one of those people. The dealership has had possession of my car for more than half of my ownership because of random things. For instance the dealership had my car for over a week because apparently a pebble lodged itself in one of the front radiator fans inside the wheel well and it was causing the fan to make a grinding noise every time it tried to activate for cooling.
Spending what I did on the car and it having more dealership ventures, and rattles than I care to endure is why it's going up for sale. Someone else can deal with all of that. At least it's CPO'd out to 2030 so any more issues that pop up will be covered for a long time.

Appreciate the detailed response. I've always wondered since the MECOSA 7spd debuted how it felt compared to a true, mechanically connected gearbox, Porsche 6spd or otherwise. Sounds like it works but ain't ideal. That could be a dealbreaker. The rattles issue, that would also be a downer. My MS3 has developed a quite yet ridiculously annoying rattle somewhere in the driver's side B pillar, at the same height as my right ear. Have yet to rip apart the plastic cladding to try and solve it, but I'm slowly getting there...

Do you find the ext range fuel tank beneficial? As a no-cost option, I have always had it on my T/GT3 build sheet but not sure it's truly needed. Not that it adds much besides a little extra weight.

I was not expecting to find this question in this chat but it's one I'm well qualified to answer! I've owned a 991.2 (2019) Carrera T since new in 2019, and along with the Blackwing it's in the 'will never sell' category. For context, I traded in a GT4 for it and I could not be happier with my choice.

The Carrera T is pretty boring on the commute, and you don't get many thrills from the straight line acceleration. It is, however, a straight up delight on twisty canyon backroads. It's not as sonorous as a GT3 but you don't need to wind it out to 7-8K RPM and hit felony speeds to really enjoy it. It has just the right amount of power and the suspension is more compliant for bumpy broken up backroads. It's hard to describe but it's just a perfectly balanced set of attributes for that use case. (Edit: I see from your profile you have a 330i ZHP so, you get it...)

If you can find a sorted 991.2 I would have it over the 992 T. Narrow body, more special interior packs, analogue gauges, arguably better looking, cheaper. Mine is tight as a drum with not a single rattle, after over 5 years of running it ragged over hellish Bay Area backroads. The stock shifter is great, not BW level great, but can be upgraded with a Numeric shifter for a shorter notchier throw.

View attachment 30907

Thanks for the breakdown! Good point about 991.2 vs 992. Much as I like my 5VBW I am already missing analogue gauges...

Yes, the usability of the T appears higher than any recent GT3. More fun to drive a slow car fast than a fast car slowly, they say...

Good to hear the Carrera T gets a rather high set of marks. Trading in the GT4 to get the T has me particularly intrigued! I see you are in the Bay area, would love to pick your brain more. Let me know and I can send you a PM.

 

[BimmerFan]

Appreciate the detailed response. I've always wondered since the MECOSA 7spd debuted how it felt compared to a true, mechanically connected gearbox, Porsche 6spd or otherwise.

Curious, have you driven a LWB back to back to a standard wheelbase option, BMW/7 or otherwise? I have never driven any LWB vs standard close together enough to know if there's a perceptible difference.

So... I had a 991.1 with the 7-speed, and found in inferior to the 6-speed. In fact, the 911 was in the shop and I had a Boxster loaner that was so much better that I ended up selling the 911 and buying a Boxster, largely because of that!

As for the BMW, I have owned both a SWB and LWB 7 series. There is a perceptible difference when you are trying to park it, for sure. One of my LWB cars had the active steering, which turns the rear wheels in the opposite direction at low speeds, which helped immensely. Unfortunately, I didn't like how it worked at high speeds (turning with the fronts) and it was the primary reason that I sold it.

The ride quality is going to be better in the LWB, but how noticeable it really is would depend on the road quality and your perception. The handling is probably also impacted, and it's heavier, but considering that in other markets BMW refers to this car as a limousine, it's probably rather moot.

 

[dizz81]

So... I had a 991.1 with the 7-speed, and found in inferior to the 6-speed. In fact, the 911 was in the shop and I had a Boxster loaner that was so much better that I ended up selling the 911 and buying a Boxster, largely because of that!

As for the BMW, I have owned both a SWB and LWB 7 series. There is a perceptible difference when you are trying to park it, for sure. One of my LWB cars had the active steering, which turns the rear wheels in the opposite direction at low speeds, which helped immensely. Unfortunately, I didn't like how it worked at high speeds (turning with the fronts) and it was the primary reason that I sold it.

The ride quality is going to be better in the LWB, but how noticeable it really is would depend on the road quality and your perception. The handling is probably also impacted, and it's heavier, but considering that in other markets BMW refers to this car as a limousine, it's probably rather moot.

Yeah after driving numerous 6spd transmission equipped cars. The 7spd in the 911 is just not that great. I mean it's notchy and you'll know you get it in to every gear. But good lord I find myself avoiding 7th gear as much as possible. I treat it like a 6spd because coming out of 7th the stick just a game of mental gymnastics and trying to feel if you're about to shift it into a gear you don't want to.