Carbon Ceramic replacement cost

[MatthewAMEL]

As someone who ordered the CCB option, I can share why I chose to and what I hope to gain over the, really good, iron brake.

I will be tracking and AutoX'ing my BW. And the main enemy of this car is weight. One of the primary reasons for my choice of CCB's is reduced un-sprung weight. It's ~20lbs per wheel. In the car world, that is huge.

Another factor for me is the way the braking on the BW has been implemented. Since it's not a hydraulic pedal, but a 'brake-by-wire' system, you lose the ability to feel the brakes getting hot (fade). This is a very big deal. I routinely enter Turn 7 at Sebring (the hairpin in front of the hotel) at 120+mph. That would be the worst possible place to discover I don't have the brake I thought I did. The CCB's simply will not fade. You get all the brake, all the time. In a 4,000lb, 700hp car, it's added piece of mind.

This is Brembo's 2nd Gen CCB. They have made significant improvements to the manufacturing process of the rotors. Brembo now says for a DD, they are a lifetime part. For tracking, you will get an equivalent number of track days out of them as the iron rotor. Since I can go 2 seasons on front rotors on my current car, I feel better about their longevity.

There is no way around that they are significantly more expensive to own/operate than Iron. But I understand this going in and I picked CCB's based on my use case.

 

[Powerhungry]

The main advantages are low dust, saving unsprung weight, & longer lasting rotors. Now the rotors are absurd in price if/when they do need replaced (see my comment above about pricing) & can be easily damaged by a clumsy tech putting on a wheel or a rogue rock. If they get chipped you’re done & must replace. As far as stopping performance is concerned according to the former stigs review of the car for TFL GM says it is the same for steel and carbon ceramic. There’s a handling advantage though with the lower unsprung weight of the CC. If you daily drive the CC rotors will likely go 100k+. If you track it then it depends on how hard you go and how much heat you throw at them. Cc rotors must be weighed to see if they’re still good not thickness measured like a traditional rotor. They usually go about twice as long as steel rotors. Depending on the track, driving style, etc most corvette guys get around 15 days out of their CC. That’s on a lighter car though.

Wow, thanks Carguyshu - appreciate the knowledgeable advice. QQ - when you say 15 days is that per year on average, or do you mean over let's say 5 years of ownership, they get about 15 track days total? I guess what I'm thinking is that if I've nothing to compare against (i.e. never tried the CC), then the steels would feel fine, right? If I do track the car, it would only be to beat my own times, not actually race. Lastly - I've heard that some folks swap out their CCs for steels if they plan to have a fairly track-intensive season. I've even heard that tracks offer swap service on-site - is that so? Thanks!

 

[Powerhungry]

This thread scares me. I'm not tracking mine, but went with ceramic figuring I should never have to change the rotors and it'll help keep brake dust to a minimum. So I figured for the extra 8400 it'll (hopefully) be worth it in the long run...or at least be close

That's sort of what I'm thinking too. Pay upfront once and hopefully good for 100k plus. This would only be a summer car for me so 100k miles will probably take longer than I'll be alive LOL. Having driven steel brake cars prior (I assume), do you feel anything different with the CCs? And overall, how are you enjoying your BW?

 

[Carguyshu]

Wow, thanks Carguyshu - appreciate the knowledgeable advice. QQ - when you say 15 days is that per year on average, or do you mean over let's say 5 years of ownership, they get about 15 track days total? I guess what I'm thinking is that if I've nothing to compare against (i.e. never tried the CC), then the steels would feel fine, right? If I do track the car, it would only be to beat my own times, not actually race. Lastly - I've heard that some folks swap out their CCs for steels if they plan to have a fairly track-intensive season. I've even heard that tracks offer swap service on-site - is that so? Thanks!

15 days of total track use. Most track days are 3 20 minute sessions. I could see them in a heavy car like this only lasting maybe 10, again depending on the track, driving style, etc. I decided to go steel. There will be a lot more pad options available besides just OEM this way and at 7k to replace front rotors only I can buy a lot of steel rotors. With additional pad options the steel could end up stopping much better compared to CCB where usually only OEM pads (with OEM price) are available. The only real advantage is lower unsprung weight.

 

[Powerhungry]

15 days of total track use. Most track days are 3 20 minute sessions. I could see them in a heavy car like this only lasting maybe 10, again depending on the track, driving style, etc. I decided to go steel. There will be a lot more pad options available besides just OEM this way and at 7k to replace front rotors only I can buy a lot of steel rotors. With additional pad options the steel could end up stopping much better compared to CCB where usually only OEM pads (with OEM price) are available. The only real advantage is lower unsprung weight.

Thanks for such clear reasoning - I found it very helpful!

 

[Powerhungry]

Thanks for such clear reasoning - I found it very helpful!

 

[dribs15]

That's sort of what I'm thinking too. Pay upfront once and hopefully good for 100k plus. This would only be a summer car for me so 100k miles will probably take longer than I'll be alive LOL. Having driven steel brake cars prior (I assume), do you feel anything different with the CCs? And overall, how are you enjoying your BW?

Sorry, but don't have mine yet TPW 2/28. But sounds like everyone had hit the little extras that this novice is aware of (but didn't have the expertise to comment on) and hope to appreciate with regards to weight/feel (I'm not getting a sun roof either). In colder weather it may take the ceramics a bit to warm up for best performance and I just saw a Motor Authority review update this AM that reports sponginess in comfort mode... but not in sport or v modes. Still excited for them though and glad to have realistic expectations.

 

[Carguyshu]

Sorry, but don't have mine yet TPW 2/28. But sounds like everyone had hit the little extras that this novice is aware of (but didn't have the expertise to comment on) and hope to appreciate with regards to weight/feel (I'm not getting a sun roof either). In colder weather it may take the ceramics a bit to warm up for best performance and I just saw a Motor Authority review update this AM that reports sponginess in comfort mode... but not in sport or v modes. Still excited for them though and glad to have realistic expectations.

The cars are brake by wire so there is no link between the brake pedal and brakes. It’s all a computer simulating feedback. There shouldn’t be a difference in feel since all feel is fake. I have a SL55 AMG, which was one of the first ever brake by wire cars ever built so I’m familiar.

 

[dribs15]

The cars are brake by wire so there is no link between the brake pedal and brakes. It’s all a computer simulating feedback. There shouldn’t be a difference in feel since all feel is fake. I have a SL55 AMG, which was one of the first ever brake by wire cars ever built so I’m familiar.

I hear you, but even though all feel is fake and computer simulated isn't that still what they are feeling and what is adjustable based on which setting you select?

 

[Carguyshu]

I hear you, but even though all feel is fake and computer simulated isn't that still what they are feeling and what is adjustable based on which setting you select?

yes the feeling is different in different modes. what i was referring to was that the feedback the computer is creating in the pedal shouldn't be different in steel brakes compared to CCB.

 

[Ergoc5]

I do have carbon ceramics in my order and I have until Tuesday March 15th to decide if I want them or not. Trying to figure out whether to keep them or not. Any feedback from people who have driven their 5 BWs for a while now with Carbon Ceramics? The 911 guys say they need to replace pads at 50% life to prolong rotor life.

 

[ericwilliamstevenson]

I do have carbon ceramics in my order and I have until Tuesday March 15th to decide if I want them or not. Trying to figure out whether to keep them or not. Any feedback from people who have driven their 5 BWs for a while now with Carbon Ceramics? The 911 guys say they need to replace pads at 50% life to prolong rotor life.

I had ceramics on my 911 turbo and opted for steelies on the BW. While the CC are cool, the replacement cost is absurd.. And if you're planning on tracking the car [ or braking hard often ], then I'd definitely recommend the standard brakes, not the CC.

10k buys a lot of pads, rotors, fluids, and tires.

 

[Ergoc5]

I had ceramics on my 911 turbo and opted for steelies on the BW. While the CC are cool, the replacement cost is absurd.. And if you're planning on tracking the car [ or braking hard often ], the I'd definitely recommend the standard brakes, not the CC.

10k buys a lot of pads, rotors, fluids, and tires.

Yeah no plans on tracking it....how is the brake dust with the steelies?

 

[ericwilliamstevenson]

Yeah no plans on tracking it....how is the brake dust with the steelies?

The goats are currently in custody of my BW, but I am sure it's not 10k bad.. And while the carbons don't dust, they do squeak.. I was always ashamed pulling up to a stop light in a 911 with squeaky breaks.. =/

 

[Ergoc5]

The goats are currently in custody of my BW, but I am sure it's not 10k bad.. And while the carbons don't dust, they do squeak.. I was always ashamed pulling up to a stop light in a 911 with squeaky breaks.. =/

Yes I do have ccbs on my 997.2 TTS but I am not the original owner. The car has 63k miles but the rotors are in great shape. I hear you on the $9k price difference and potential resale down the road.

 

[GT325]

I am doing CCBs on my 5BW. Will be on the track a few times. The CCBs should last the life of the car. As horrible as it sounds I am doing it mostly for the brake dust. CCBs on my other cars had a slightly different pedal feel a sharper initial bite than their iron counterparts but other than that I can’t feel any difference with unstrung weight.

 

[ericwilliamstevenson]

I am doing CCBs on my 5BW. Will be on the track a few times. The CCBs should last the life of the car. As horrible as it sounds I am doing it mostly for the brake dust. CCBs on my other cars had a slightly different pedal feel a sharper initial bite than their iron counterparts but other than that I can’t feel any difference with unstrung weight.

With any track time the CCBs will not last the life of the car.

I would swap out with steelies for any track days.

https://gmauthority.com/blog/2019/03/carbon-ceramic-brakes-arent-ideal-for-track-use-expert-says/

 

[GT325]

CCBs are fine for an occasional track day, certainly for someone at my level (i have only done 20-30 track days in my life). Totally agree for anything more than an occasional track day would swap to irons. I will probably only get the 5BW on the track a few times.

 

[MatthewAMEL]

Folks...as you consider CCB vs Iron and will be tracking, keep in mind these are the Gen2 Brembo CC rotors. They changed the composition of the fibers. They claim that for road only use, they are a lifetime part, for tracking, they now last as long as an iron rotor.

Keep in mind with the change to the braking system in the BW5, fade with the iron brake will be an on/off. With the CCB's you never have to worry about fade.

 

[Carguyshu]

Folks...as you consider CCB vs Iron and will be tracking, keep in mind these are the Gen2 Brembo CC rotors. They changed the composition of the fibers. They claim that for road only use, they are a lifetime part, for tracking, they now last as long as an iron rotor.

Keep in mind with the change to the braking system in the BW5, fade with the iron brake will be an on/off. With the CCB's you never have to worry about fade.

They may last as long, which isn’t very long. 15 days. That’s a lot of money per day when you look at CCB rotor costs. I’m sure there will soon be other pad offerings as there always are from aftermarket companies that are track only pads with better braking ability and zero fade for the steel. As soon as I get mine in a month or so I intend on bringing it to the track and finding out if the steels actually do fade at all. I’ve seen zero information that would indicate they do. The only tidbit I’ve found was that the former stig who reviewed the car for TFL said GM told him the braking performance between the ccb & steel are the same & the only thing you’re gaining from a track use perspective is lower unsprung weight