CT4-V Blackwing...kind of slow

[565565]

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a15105757/2016-cadillac-ats-v-sedan-test-review/

Car and Driver once tested an ATS-V that trapped 122mph in the quarter mile. It just have been a preproduction ringer that had the boost turned up because no stock ATS-V or CT4 BW has gotten close since. I think that amount of performance would be perfect for the 4BW.

 

[Roadhawk]

When I just did the Stage 1 chip (and intake) in my otherwise stock 2012 GTI which was maybe 50hp (don't remember exactly) I commented that this is what it should have been right from the factory - it just felt right for the car. Of course Stage 3 with the big turbo (w DP & exhaust etc) is just in a different realm entirely - at certain temps I can spin wheels through all 5 gears,,,of course FWD...but its quite fun to spin out through the gears accelerating wickedly the whole time.

I think the 4 BW could do with another 50-100 hp. If it were AWD I would want it down low to give it more umph right off the line. But its RWD so unless your putting huge slicks or such on the back its not practical really. And while many of us would appreciate more go up top...also in reality it gets going quite quickly even as is...so is it actually necessary? Probably not....but I still want it have to admit...

 

[raptor5244]

When I just did the Stage 1 chip (and intake) in my otherwise stock 2012 GTI which was maybe 50hp (don't remember exactly) I commented that this is what it should have been right from the factory - it just felt right for the car. Of course Stage 3 with the big turbo (w DP & exhaust etc) is just in a different realm entirely - at certain temps I can spin wheels through all 5 gears,,,of course FWD...but its quite fun to spin out through the gears accelerating wickedly the whole time.

I think the 4 BW could do with another 50-100 hp. If it were AWD I would want it down low to give it more umph right off the line. But its RWD so unless your putting huge slicks or such on the back its not practical really. And while many of us would appreciate more go up top...also in reality it gets going quite quickly even as is...so is it actually necessary? Probably not....but I still want it have to admit...

I always found when I added more power to my cars it would be fun for a bit and then I would get used to it pretty quick and want more and more. Then you realize you need bigger brakes, stronger transmission parts, stickier tires, etc. Once the mod bug bites you can't help but scratch the itch.

I am bit older now and find the 4BW in stock form is quick enough. That said, vehicles are so heavy now, I would rather they find a way to reduce weight vs. adding more power. A lighter, more toss-able car is always more fun and you don't need to engineer in such heavy beefed up parts to handle the weight and power. Lighter vehicles are more efficient, which translates to less wear and tear on brakes, tires, suspension and offers better fuel economy.

 

[raptor5244]

ah i miss my gt350

A buddy of mine has a yellow one, best exhaust note. He does wish it had some more torque though, he says you need to wring it out to get the power out of it, which is a challenge on the street, especially with that exhaust screaming from a half mile away.

 

[Joszer]

I did a 12s quarter mile on my CT4 BW 6sp Manual last night on a crappy old back road.

Just spend the $600 for a JB4 or go crazy on a Full Unlocked Tune to get it to your liking. For me bringing it up to ~490-500 whp (stock M3 levels) is the sweet spot for this car.

 

[savethemanual]

I did a 12s quarter mile on my CT4 BW 6sp Manual last night on a crappy old back road.

Just spend the $600 for a JB4 or go crazy on a Full Unlocked Tune to get it to your liking. For me bringing it up to ~490-500 whp (stock M3 levels) is the sweet spot for this car.
View attachment 23318

So 600$ JB4 brings it to 500 whp with no other mods?

 

[raptor5244]

I did a 12s quarter mile on my CT4 BW 6sp Manual last night on a crappy old back road.

Just spend the $600 for a JB4 or go crazy on a Full Unlocked Tune to get it to your liking. For me bringing it up to ~490-500 whp (stock M3 levels) is the sweet spot for this car.
View attachment 23318

To me, that is quick, these 4BWs really can put the power down, even with the 18 inch wheels/tires. In my ZL1 the best 1/4 mile time I could muster on a backroad using the built in timer was 11.5 sec and that was with the A10. I am sure on a prepped track with a great launch I could have done better but not much.

Forget about the M6 ZL1s, it bogs pretty bad when you tried to launch it hard so those cars would be even slower. What was your 0-60 on that run? For reference, this is how the ZL1s typically launch, 4.2sec to 60mph. The A10s do much better, I would get 3.7-3.9 depending on the traction. Like I was mentioning earlier in the thread, that extra horsepower of the LT4 helps when you can let it stretch its legs to like 130mph but at typical street stuff I don't miss any power from the ZL1.

 

[raptor5244]

So 600$ JB4 brings it to 500 whp with no other mods?

You can see the packages offered below. Now that they have cracked the E99 Global B ECMs I would prefer that over the JB4 so you have full tuning control.

470 to 500 whp CT4-V Blackwing White Belt Package - Tapout Tuning

This performance package will normally produce gains of 50 to 85 whp, giving you 470 to 500 peak whp with 93-octane fuel on a DynoJet dyno, using SAE correction and smoothing = 5. The 470 to 500 whp range for White Belt is due to fuel octane (91, 92 or 93 octane). Includes Tapout Tuning Trunk...

www.tapouttuning.com

 

[Roadhawk]

I always found when I added more power to my cars it would be fun for a bit and then I would get used to it pretty quick and want more and more. Then you realize you need bigger brakes, stronger transmission parts, stickier tires, etc. Once the mod bug bites you can't help but scratch the itch.

I am bit older now and find the 4BW in stock form is quick enough. That said, vehicles are so heavy now, I would rather they find a way to reduce weight vs. adding more power. A lighter, more toss-able car is always more fun and you don't need to engineer in such heavy beefed up parts to handle the weight and power. Lighter vehicles are more efficient, which translates to less wear and tear on brakes, tires, suspension and offers better fuel economy.

I get you...but usually I just decide what I want and go with it and am happy not caring for more per se. I am a big believer in chassis stiffing (bracing), thicker anti-roll bars and other handling adjustments to make the most - for driving enjoyment. I'm usually satisfied with the power. I've never done a thing to my 330 ZHP - its just perfect as it IMO even if not the fastest - plenty quick enough and fun doing it. Should have done LSD perhaps...but Ok without it.

Except for perhaps some Porsches like the Caymen or cars like the Miata or BRZ everything is going to be heavy...and larger than the last model etc. (why I like M2 over M3s...but even they are too heavy....like the 4 BW...) Some is safety stuff - what can be done...option is to buy and drive older cars...

 

[Joszer]

To me, that is quick, these 4BWs really can put the power down, even with the 18 inch wheels/tires. In my ZL1 the best 1/4 mile time I could muster on a backroad using the built in timer was 11.5 sec and that was with the A10. I am sure on a prepped track with a great launch I could have done better but not much.

Forget about the M6 ZL1s, it bogs pretty bad when you tried to launch it hard so those cars would be even slower. What was your 0-60 on that run? For reference, this is how the ZL1s typically launch, 4.2sec to 60mph. The A10s do much better, I would get 3.7-3.9 depending on the traction. Like I was mentioning earlier in the thread, that extra horsepower of the LT4 helps when you can let it stretch its legs to like 130mph but at typical street stuff I don't miss any power from the ZL1.

I had a 2018 ZL1 1LE and I totally forgot about the bogging it would do. Got rid of it after a year of tracking it and unable to tolerate the stiff suspension on the street. Not to mention that those Goodyear Supercar 3R tires are hard as a rock when they have no heat in them.

I managed to get a 4s flat 0-60 with my 6sp on my CT4BW on a back road.

 

[Joszer]

So 600$ JB4 brings it to 500 whp with no other mods?

Depending on gas quality you can get close.

Eventually when my warranty is up I'll move over to a full ECU Tune. For right now the JB4 suits my needs because I can remove the module before any dealer check in.

 

[Yalferd]

for me, the JB4 would be fine. California is making it harder to get away with a tuned vehicle (from what I've read) in that they are supposedly going to be looking at fueling or boost levels that aren't stock. JB4 is easily removed/replaced (even though I have another 7 years til that's an issue). And to be honest, the only time I want or even remotely need more HP is at the track, which is my hobby/obsession even though I have a long way to go.

 

[Joszer]

for me, the JB4 would be fine. California is making it harder to get away with a tuned vehicle (from what I've read) in that they are supposedly going to be looking at fueling or boost levels that aren't stock. JB4 is easily removed/replaced (even though I have another 7 years til that's an issue). And to be honest, the only time I want or even remotely need more HP is at the track, which is my hobby/obsession even though I have a long way to go.

I'm in the same boat. I have tracked my Blackwing three times already, once at Buttonwillow and twice at Thunderhill here in Cali. All three times I had my JB4 essentially turned off. I feel like the stock power is more than enough for track and didn't want to run into timing/heat issues with the long sessions at WOT. I wouldn't trust the JB4 to make everything run smooth with longer HPDE sessions. For quarter mile, stoplight WOT pulls it does a good job though!

 

[Yalferd]

Thunderhill East or west? I think this car is well suited to East, but was worried it's a little ungainly for west? What's your opinion? My "home track" is Laguna Seca, but will be doing at least Button Willow in 2024

 

[Joszer]

Thunderhill East or west? I think this car is well suited to East, but was worried it's a little ungainly for west? What's your opinion? My "home track" is Laguna Seca, but will be doing at least Button Willow in 2024

I've only done east with the the Blackwing. It handles well for it's size so it should do ok on west. West is a lot like Buttonwillow where you have to rely a lot on momentum. Either way, no matter how good you are in the caddy, you'll always have someone in a S2000 or Miata pass you up on those small tracks

 

[savethemanual]

Depending on gas quality you can get close.

Eventually when my warranty is up I'll move over to a full ECU Tune. For right now the JB4 suits my needs because I can remove the module before any dealer check in.

I ll probably wait until warranty ends to decide what to do.

If I’m keeping the car beyond warranty period I ll probably get a tune.

 

[Soundman414]

Chasing HP only goes so far. There aren't a lot of cars that tick a ton of boxes. Usually, there are compromises that an enthusiast doesn't like; cost, reliability, daily usability, and more.

You also need to consider the situation we are in with enthusiast cars... it's both thriving and dying. Really good cars get overlooked because they don't go .2 seconds quicker to 60 than a competitor, or the engine can't hypothetically reach 1000hp if you "only" threw an extra $30k at it with mods.

Just think... We had the Chevy SS with a manual transmission. The car that many scream today is what they want the CT4 BW to be. But did people buy it... nope, because it didn't look special, or only had a plebian LS3, or the M3 was a bit quicker... so what happened? That car died.

People put so much weight into perception, brand, and hypothetical expectations, only to overlook the aspects of cars that really matter to most people day in and day out with ownership.

How many more times are you going to get not one, but two American sports sedans, with the option for manual transmissions, reliable powertrains, non-polarizing styling, and 10s of thousands of dollars less than German rivals... All while the writing is on the wall that ICE is on its way out and within 10-15 years, you'll be literally crying for cars like this.

Support the underdogs that bet on us enthusiasts... because those will be rare going forward. Soon they'll try and sell you on a 4800lb electric "sports car" that costs $120k and makes you think that it's going to bring you driving pleasure.

 

[PL69]

Chasing HP only goes so far. There aren't a lot of cars that tick a ton of boxes. Usually, there are compromises that an enthusiast doesn't like; cost, reliability, daily usability, and more.

You also need to consider the situation we are in with enthusiast cars... it's both thriving and dying. Really good cars get overlooked because they don't go .2 seconds quicker to 60 than a competitor, or the engine can't hypothetically reach 1000hp if you "only" threw an extra $30k at it with mods.

Just think... We had the Chevy SS with a manual transmission. The car that many scream today is what they want the CT4 BW to be. But did people buy it... nope, because it didn't look special, or only had a plebian LS3, or the M3 was a bit quicker... so what happened? That car died.

People put so much weight into perception, brand, and hypothetical expectations, only to overlook the aspects of cars that really matter to most people day in and day out with ownership.

How many more times are you going to get not one, but two American sports sedans, with the option for manual transmissions, reliable powertrains, non-polarizing styling, and 10s of thousands of dollars less than German rivals... All while the writing is on the wall that ICE is on its way out and within 10-15 years, you'll be literally crying for cars like this.

Support the underdogs that bet on us enthusiasts... because those will be rare going forward. Soon they'll try and sell you on a 4800lb electric "sports car" that costs $120k and makes you think that it's going to bring you driving pleasure.

I vote to nominate this post of the year!

 

[dinkman]

A buddy of mine has a yellow one, best exhaust note. He does wish it had some more torque though, he says you need to wring it out to get the power out of it, which is a challenge on the street, especially with that exhaust screaming from a half mile away.

yea the low end torque was awful and the exhaust can be heard from very far distances so you draw a lof of attention.
you also drew some negative attention from certain other drivers if your had a particular vanity plate on it
was a hell of a car on track tho. easily outpaced most things twice its price

 

[Roadhawk]

You also need to consider the situation we are in with enthusiast cars... it's both thriving and dying.

People put so much weight into perception, brand, and hypothetical expectations, only to overlook the aspects of cars that really matter to most people day in and day out with ownership.

How many more times are you going to get not one, but two American sports sedans, with the option for manual transmissions, reliable powertrains, non-polarizing styling, and 10s of thousands of dollars less than German rivals... All while the writing is on the wall that ICE is on its way out and within 10-15 years, you'll be literally crying for cars like this.

Support the underdogs that bet on us enthusiasts... because those will be rare going forward. Soon they'll try and sell you on a 4800lb electric "sports car" that costs $120k and makes you think that it's going to bring you driving pleasure.

This is why I bought a 4 BW (without ever actually driven one). I just knew - from its ATS-V heritage and all the reviews that it was the car to get...and for me over the 5 because of both price and my preference for a smaller car.

We didn't really need a new car just yet...but I was starting to panic...particularly after driving (and looking at) a few of the new BMWs and also seeing Audi (and just about everyone else) abandoning MT.

And don't even start me on electric. Fine for everyone else - I mean the Camry has always been a fine car....just not for me...